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Post by grimgryphon on Jul 28, 2015 21:21:12 GMT
www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/game-release-launching.34215/OP is such a silly boy. Last two wipes I logged in within seconds of the servers going live and most city plots were taken and some plots had fully decorated yards. So this leads me to believe that: 1. High-level backers are not getting wiped, or 2. High-level backers are getting much earlier access. Going to keep an eye on it for R20 as well. Got screenshots of a few plots and we'll see if they are identical right after release. I have my suspicions.
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 28, 2015 21:33:34 GMT
www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/game-release-launching.34215/OP is such a silly boy. Last two releases I logged in within seconds of the servers going live and most city plots were taken and some plots had fully decorated yards. So this leads me to believe that: 1. High-level backers are not getting wiped, or 2. High-level backers are getting much earlier access. Going to keep an eye on it for R20 as well. Got screenshots of a few plots and we'll see if they are identical right after release. I have my suspicions. High level backers definitely get a few days jump on everyone else. Not a secret exactly. But they don't say it in the release notes.
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 28, 2015 21:35:55 GMT
They also gave/give the high level backers more gold than they can possibly use, presumably to "test" more. Because they are more "devoted." I know this only because one of them gave me a lot of gold and told me about it, in game.
Otherwise, the rest of the people have no clue.
I mean, if they really want people to test, everyone should get sufficient gold to do it. I asked for it in the forums. Of course nothing came of it.
Also, if they really wanted to test housing load, they really should have a land rush.
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Post by kd on Jul 28, 2015 21:44:14 GMT
I always thought the same and its been going on for ages. I was usually one of the first on and always noticed many of the prime spots gone, my thoughts is that it not high end backers with extra privileges but port staff and runners making the server look busy and nicely presented in prime locations.
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Post by nemolives on Jul 28, 2015 22:04:51 GMT
I suspect it's the Dev+ backers on the test server, which just gets rolled out to live instead of reset; I've been there at server up and got to cities to find that not only are the houses already there but already decorated sometimes, which they wouldn't have had time to do.
It's a minor issue in Alpha, but I've commented months ago I DESPISE the design they had for the launch land rush. It was the first inkling I had that they really had no idea what actual fairness to their backers, much less the later audience (that I now believe they won't have) is; 10 hours to place? What about those of us who work? Or are in another time zone to the one our placement appears in? What about the atrocious prioritising of people just for spending extra in the store, which goes against the Kickstarter setup completely?
One of my most memorable moments in UO was the Malas land rush; but then, I didn't have to pay thousands of dollars to take part and everything that happened that day was an outright gain from nothing. I really, really don't think the Devs at Shroud understand their own industry's history, which considering they helped forge it is an incredible decay in talent!
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Post by dewderonomy on Jul 29, 2015 0:32:59 GMT
I suspect it's the Dev+ backers on the test server, which just gets rolled out to live instead of reset; I've been there at server up and got to cities to find that not only are the houses already there but already decorated sometimes, which they wouldn't have had time to do. It's a minor issue in Alpha, but I've commented months ago I DESPISE the design they had for the launch land rush. It was the first inkling I had that they really had no idea what actual fairness to their backers, much less the later audience (that I now believe they won't have) is; 10 hours to place? What about those of us who work? Or are in another time zone to the one our placement appears in? What about the atrocious prioritising of people just for spending extra in the store, which goes against the Kickstarter setup completely? One of my most memorable moments in UO was the Malas land rush; but then, I didn't have to pay thousands of dollars to take part and everything that happened that day was an outright gain from nothing. I really, really don't think the Devs at Shroud understand their own industry's history, which considering they helped forge it is an incredible decay in talent! That reminds me of the Trammel land rush, when everyone was trying to scalp even shitty 8x8 locations. I was running around looking for a spot, watching as the clock ticked away. Panicking, I was in the middle of a bunch of people with a small plot of land. Hurriedly placed my small stone tower and bam, got lucky on the countdown, I guess. Then the fucking server wiped, and I had to go back and do the same shit over again. lol Had that spot for ages. It was kind of fun, though, but let's face it: there won't be a land rush of actual players. It'll be a handful of people doing this, being that there's no way the bulk of people will have had time to build a character, farm gold, etc. and buy a deed before most of the plots are settled by the whales. D E A D G A M E I S D E A D
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Post by Housewife British on Jul 29, 2015 1:43:43 GMT
I know pretty much exactly what is going on here and it has been going on for a very long time. I know what I know because I have been part of these groups receiving special treatment and have witnessed what has been going on, I also receive the same treatment if I choose. I have also brought this topic up quite a bit because I think it is complete bullshit that some favored people are getting the special treatment and others have to go do the grind. So basically BurningToad and OneandOnly are giving the hand outs to favorite players, that includes as many unrefined materials they want and as much money as they want. I am not sure if BurningToad and OneandOnly are getting orders from above or not but it does seem like these two have some favorites themselves. What I've heard for an excuse when people have questioned this is that the developers think that these people getting the hand outs are the reason anyone plays the game at all. Like the shitty maze that no one uses and is shit time after time again, I'm sure that shit box is bringing in loads of players. They need to think up a better excuse. I also think if they setup some kind of npc that gave everyone in game unrefined resources and unlimited money, that we would see way more creative things happening in the world than the garbage these favorite guilds that get unlimited whatever are doing now. It is a straight up favoritism thing, there is no denying that, it has nothing to do with what your pledge is at either, I know a few people getting these hand outs with not so high of a pledge. I could name a lot of names here that have been getting hand outs but I'm sure it's pretty apparent who's getting them. One person I will throw under the bus is Violation because he mysteriously manages to gain a high level without even playing the game. I've seen him leveled up so high in such a short period of time that it is impossible to even reach that level in the time frame given. I have this clown on my friends list and rarely do I see him on enough to even get there in the first place. Granted that I cannot see his screen to view his character level, I'm assuming here until I got absolute proof but what I have seen is the skills he uses, the damage he does and mostly of all, him bragging about getting leveled up to test pvp. I can almost handle the hand outs that BurningToad and OneandOnly give out but granting others a higher level is crossing far over the line.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 1:49:06 GMT
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Post by Housewife British on Jul 29, 2015 1:57:00 GMT
It's been happening way before steam or the test server. Back then we used to get our handouts when Dev+ got early access hours before the same server went live to non Dev+.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 2:00:52 GMT
It's been happening way before steam or the test server. Back then we used to get our handouts when Dev+ got early access hours before the same server went live to non Dev+. Yup, this stuff goes way back. There is a lot of housing stuff people don't even know about yet that is pretty scary too. I think some would be pretty shocked.
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Post by Housewife British on Jul 29, 2015 2:18:32 GMT
It is to bad that housing has turned into what it is, and is a money grab. It's the only thing that the game remotely has going for it. They also completely butchered housing with these carebear faggot restriction limits, that is what absolutely killed housing for me. Fuck these carebear whiny fucks. I know this one's on Darkstar the tranny though, what a sad excuse for a man, so sensitive and fruity.
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Post by Housewife British on Jul 29, 2015 2:22:05 GMT
God forbid that I have to put in work to create a fence with a gate to keep people out, we all need mechanics to save our inner faggot to restrict people from even entering our screen.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 2:27:35 GMT
I don't think fences will be popular, if you fence off the property how can people get in to inspect and vote on your property for the Real Housewives of New Britannia home deco show??
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Post by FYI on Jul 29, 2015 3:18:13 GMT
You guys have outdated info.
Dev server USED to roll over into live. It does not now, devtest server lets a smaller segment of people test it out, but it doesn't roll over into live anymore (not for like 7 or 8 releases or more). Gold WAS handed out, freely to anyone who PMd certain devs, they didn't see the issue it might cause, it obviously caused an issue, now it is not handed out. Resources used to be handed to Paxlair and Bear Tavern and other groups, now they are not - being a member of both those groups - they send out their members to accumulate the resources now that go to the big projects and setting up. They just have a lot of manpower.
Sometimes you guys have cool stuff here to read (love reading deleted threads, satisfies my morbid curiousity) but this thread is completely inaccurate.
I can't know 100% for sure that zero folks get a handout, but I can tell you as a high backer, that there's no advantage in the release aside from some obvious ones
- don't need to earn gold to buy a deed, can just run out and claim. - can sell pledge items to players for gold if you care to do that.
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 29, 2015 3:22:32 GMT
The first article, I didn't know people were doing this gold exploit. So I guess that means Portalarium rewarded them by giving them more gold than they could use, and they could hand it out to whoever they wanted. Talk about dividing the community more and more. No wonder there's been so much strife among players. I knew they got insane amounts of gold but not the reason. These folks truly have "Forsaken Virtues," with Portalarium at the top of the list. The 2nd article, I had no clue about all this either. All this makes me especially glad I'm selling my account (still haven't heard back if the account split has happened). I know you've said you might actually play, but even if they made all the changes I think the game needs, I have zero interest in ever playing the game. But it is interesting to hear about all the shenanigans.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 3:28:55 GMT
You guys have outdated info. Dev server USED to roll over into live. It does not now, devtest server lets a smaller segment of people test it out, but it doesn't roll over into live anymore (not for like 7 or 8 releases or more). Gold WAS handed out, freely to anyone who PMd certain devs, they didn't see the issue it might cause, it obviously caused an issue, now it is not handed out. Resources used to be handed to Paxlair and Bear Tavern and other groups, now they are not - being a member of both those groups - they send out their members to accumulate the resources now that go to the big projects and setting up. They just have a lot of manpower. Sometimes you guys have cool stuff here to read (love reading deleted threads, satisfies my morbid curiousity) but this thread is completely inaccurate. I can't know 100% for sure that zero folks get a handout, but I can tell you as a high backer, that there's no advantage in the release aside from some obvious ones - don't need to earn gold to buy a deed, can just run out and claim. - can sell pledge items to players for gold if you care to do that. Then I trust that the screen shots grim returns will be of clean clear house lots and not fully deco'd shit If that is the case, then it is a good step forward. But the last time they had a "wipe" (can't remember the R number but you are right 7 or 8 releases but we haven't wiped since then either) I guarantee you, people got money and shit was everywhere. So technically yeah it was a while ago but still only one wipe ago
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 29, 2015 3:30:08 GMT
they didn't see the issue it might cause, it obviously caused an issue, If they can be this short-sighted over one issue like this, what does that tell us about the larger issues? We keep telling them about issues they cause and they ignore too many people and still favor the whales. You can't possibly dispute that. It leaves a bad taste in anyone's mouth, except the ones getting the favors. What kind of virtues did you say they were displaying? Just because they "aren't doing it anymore" doesn't mean there aren't still ongoing issues and leaving people with a terrible impression. I know it left me with a lot of animosity towards Portalarium for doing that kind of nonsense. They don't seem to care who they estrange, as long as the whales keep shoveling cash at them.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 3:31:27 GMT
The first article, I didn't know people were doing this gold exploit. So I guess that means Portalarium rewarded them by giving them more gold than they could use, and they could hand it out to whoever they wanted. Talk about dividing the community more and more. No wonder there's been so much strife among players. I knew they got insane amounts of gold but not the reason. These folks truly have "Forsaken Virtues," with Portalarium at the top of the list. The 2nd article, I had no clue about all this either. All this makes me especially glad I'm selling my account (still haven't heard back if the account split has happened). I know you've said you might actually play, but even if they made all the changes I think the game needs, I have zero interest in ever playing the game. But it is interesting to hear about all the shenanigans. Read my entire blog. You'll either die of laughter or be as Insane as I am...
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 29, 2015 3:38:41 GMT
The first article, I didn't know people were doing this gold exploit. So I guess that means Portalarium rewarded them by giving them more gold than they could use, and they could hand it out to whoever they wanted. Talk about dividing the community more and more. No wonder there's been so much strife among players. I knew they got insane amounts of gold but not the reason. These folks truly have "Forsaken Virtues," with Portalarium at the top of the list. The 2nd article, I had no clue about all this either. All this makes me especially glad I'm selling my account (still haven't heard back if the account split has happened). I know you've said you might actually play, but even if they made all the changes I think the game needs, I have zero interest in ever playing the game. But it is interesting to hear about all the shenanigans. Read my entire blog. You'll either die of laughter or be as Insane as I am... I've read bits here & there, over the last couple years. But not consistently. I'll have to look at some more!
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dodgy
Strong in the Force
Posts: 1,171
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Land Rush
Jul 29, 2015 3:45:39 GMT
via mobile
Post by dodgy on Jul 29, 2015 3:45:39 GMT
You guys have outdated info. Dev server USED to roll over into live. It does not now, devtest server lets a smaller segment of people test it out, but it doesn't roll over into live anymore (not for like 7 or 8 releases or more). Gold WAS handed out, freely to anyone who PMd certain devs, they didn't see the issue it might cause, it obviously caused an issue, now it is not handed out. Resources used to be handed to Paxlair and Bear Tavern and other groups, now they are not - being a member of both those groups - they send out their members to accumulate the resources now that go to the big projects and setting up. They just have a lot of manpower. Sometimes you guys have cool stuff here to read (love reading deleted threads, satisfies my morbid curiousity) but this thread is completely inaccurate. I can't know 100% for sure that zero folks get a handout, but I can tell you as a high backer, that there's no advantage in the release aside from some obvious ones - don't need to earn gold to buy a deed, can just run out and claim. - can sell pledge items to players for gold if you care to do that. Hey mate thanks for clearing it up. So we can stop saying the process is on going. I guess we will see r20 after the wipe. Least that has stopped. You mind saying what your high backing is and share with us how you feel about the dev process and some of our gripes? It's good to have fresh insight here coz we do sometimes tunnel vision (though we do reference) . It's good to maintain the validity of our argument and tangents to get other people's view.
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dodgy
Strong in the Force
Posts: 1,171
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Land Rush
Jul 29, 2015 3:47:02 GMT
via mobile
Post by dodgy on Jul 29, 2015 3:47:02 GMT
I didn't care about gold being handed out until it was to just the usual culprits and when they brought gold in required to respec. That really hindered me playing around
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Post by FYI on Jul 29, 2015 3:57:51 GMT
I'm a Duke, I have access to a Lord of the Manor pledge (not mine).
No benefits.
Sometimes we know things that others don't about upcoming plans... but then what we "knew" has often changed. It's the whole lawyer phrase to "don't quote me on this."
I didn't have a clue about that town editor for instance... and it seems like "holy crap this is dev time going into yet ANOTHER feature we don't need" but then you realize they no longer need to individually place crap, then make changes, etc. etc. and they're now just making a few templates (often just modified in some ways from existing ones) and the town owners do the work laying out the lots.
Can ask me any questions, I'll answer if I can. And if I remember to come back and read.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Jul 29, 2015 4:10:47 GMT
I'm a Duke, I have access to a Lord of the Manor pledge (not mine). No benefits. Sometimes we know things that others don't about upcoming plans... but then what we "knew" has often changed. It's the whole lawyer phrase to "don't quote me on this." I didn't have a clue about that town editor for instance... and it seems like "holy crap this is dev time going into yet ANOTHER feature we don't need" but then you realize they no longer need to individually place crap, then make changes, etc. etc. and they're now just making a few templates (often just modified in some ways from existing ones) and the town owners do the work laying out the lots. Can ask me any questions, I'll answer if I can. And if I remember to come back and read. It is all connected. What was the time spent on the town editor for? To free a possibly greater burden on the devs to fulfil their promise to have a design session with POT owners. Why is this even a thing? Player Owned Towns. Are they in the Kick start. No. Are they dragging the game progress down. Yes. That is an entire set of features we don't need.
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Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
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Post by Caliya on Jul 29, 2015 4:16:07 GMT
I'm a Duke, I have access to a Lord of the Manor pledge (not mine). No benefits. Sometimes we know things that others don't about upcoming plans... but then what we "knew" has often changed. It's the whole lawyer phrase to "don't quote me on this." I didn't have a clue about that town editor for instance... and it seems like "holy crap this is dev time going into yet ANOTHER feature we don't need" but then you realize they no longer need to individually place crap, then make changes, etc. etc. and they're now just making a few templates (often just modified in some ways from existing ones) and the town owners do the work laying out the lots. Can ask me any questions, I'll answer if I can. And if I remember to come back and read. It's water under the bridge. Look at the design of Winfield's POT, the announcements, the sitting down with him, and all the rest. That was a lot of man hours, and even giving POT owners the tools takes time. They were snowballed about POTs overnight, and of course they had to switch strategies. Poor fools who bought POTs thinking they would be on the map. lol Port can take all the time to make things, as special favors to high level backers, while not even creating the basic rewards for each pledge level for how long now? Oh ya, since the beginning. But a POT, of course they have time to build them individually until they're overwhelmed and now have to turn tools over. POTs are riddled with so many problems, it was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
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Post by Sicherdraht on Jul 29, 2015 4:31:12 GMT
Gold hand out has been going on for a long time, this is a result of the boot licking going on. I have lost all respect for the creators of this game it's not funny anymore. Thinking this will not extend to retail release, your drinking SotA grape mix.
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Post by nemolives on Jul 29, 2015 11:51:58 GMT
I'm a Duke, I have access to a Lord of the Manor pledge (not mine). No benefits. Sometimes we know things that others don't about upcoming plans... but then what we "knew" has often changed. It's the whole lawyer phrase to "don't quote me on this." I didn't have a clue about that town editor for instance... and it seems like "holy crap this is dev time going into yet ANOTHER feature we don't need" but then you realize they no longer need to individually place crap, then make changes, etc. etc. and they're now just making a few templates (often just modified in some ways from existing ones) and the town owners do the work laying out the lots. Can ask me any questions, I'll answer if I can. And if I remember to come back and read. Well there hasn't been a wipe for a few releases, so of course our impressions are out of date; we've not actually seen a fresh start for quite some time. Here's my question to you; If you have Dev+ access, was anyone in there pushing back against the PoT redesign, when apparently according to the newsletter, it was being discussed in there Portalarium knew they were getting close to the maximum amount they could put on the map, yet they were still taking funding for it? Didn't anyone say how it wasn't fair to backers that they didn't think they could honour the design it was being sold with? The final decision came a day before they hit the actual final maximum (but above what they had been thinking, 200-220 on the map) but prices haven't dropped; isn't anyone fighting against their appalling funding models in Dev+? Likewise on the removal of pledge rewards for people who thought they'd signed up, as far back as Kickstarter, to a clear progression path if they funded more... Anyone in Dev+ is already safe, but as someone who "only" spent $300 it feels like I'm a second class citizen already, I'd love to know if anyone who is deeper invested actually dares say "This is a terrible idea!" out of principle?
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Post by grimgryphon on Jul 29, 2015 12:30:55 GMT
Just for clarification and to avoid the discussion going down the wrong path, I meant the last two wipes, not releases. I've corrected the OP to reflect that.
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Post by FYI on Jul 29, 2015 14:57:51 GMT
Just for clarification and to avoid the discussion going down the wrong path, I meant the last two wipes, not releases. I've corrected the OP to reflect that. I understood you meant wipes - and yes, the last wipe definitely (and I think the one before, I'd have to go back and read the patch notes to situate myself there) there was no rollover from the QA server to Live. They're completely separate. The QA server you get a bit more gold (like 10k?) but it doesn't carry to live - levels, lots, gold, it's completely separate. The QA server resets more, and sometimes it has pulled data from live, but not vice versa. Think Diablo PTR server.
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Post by FYI on Jul 29, 2015 15:18:53 GMT
I'm a Duke, I have access to a Lord of the Manor pledge (not mine). No benefits. Sometimes we know things that others don't about upcoming plans... but then what we "knew" has often changed. It's the whole lawyer phrase to "don't quote me on this." I didn't have a clue about that town editor for instance... and it seems like "holy crap this is dev time going into yet ANOTHER feature we don't need" but then you realize they no longer need to individually place crap, then make changes, etc. etc. and they're now just making a few templates (often just modified in some ways from existing ones) and the town owners do the work laying out the lots. Can ask me any questions, I'll answer if I can. And if I remember to come back and read. Well there hasn't been a wipe for a few releases, so of course our impressions are out of date; we've not actually seen a fresh start for quite some time. Here's my question to you; If you have Dev+ access, was anyone in there pushing back against the PoT redesign, when apparently according to the newsletter, it was being discussed in there Portalarium knew they were getting close to the maximum amount they could put on the map, yet they were still taking funding for it? Didn't anyone say how it wasn't fair to backers that they didn't think they could honour the design it was being sold with? The final decision came a day before they hit the actual final maximum (but above what they had been thinking, 200-220 on the map) but prices haven't dropped; isn't anyone fighting against their appalling funding models in Dev+? Likewise on the removal of pledge rewards for people who thought they'd signed up, as far back as Kickstarter, to a clear progression path if they funded more... Anyone in Dev+ is already safe, but as someone who "only" spent $300 it feels like I'm a second class citizen already, I'd love to know if anyone who is deeper invested actually dares say "This is a terrible idea!" out of principle? The last two wipes there was no carry over from live. I did manage to run in pretty quickly after the last wipe and saw one keep lot unclaimed and a castle lot unclaimed - about 4 hours in and there was still 2 town lots in central Owlshead unclaimed, though most lots were claimed. About 4 hours in also there was a town lot in Soltown available and a few village lots. The first place I actually ran was Owlshead, I wanted the city lot there but missed it to Guni (who also got a Keep Lot in Ardoris quick). Re: Dev+ I thought the dev forum would be the dreamland of insider information and quick responses. It was my main motivation to upgrade to that tier actually. In practice - we mostly get things a few days in advance. Threads don't get better responses and sometimes get bumped a few times hoping for them. Most dev+ will post in the general forums, but there is discussion in both - but it's the dev+ speaking in both. There isn't much that's "secret" in those forums. There has been plenty of outcry from dev+ backers on plenty of topics, there's some greedy folks - but that has nothing to do with pledge levels. SOME people hate the idea of phasing out rewards. SOME people like it for perceived value going to their own pledge. MOST people (my opinion, I did not do a survey), myself included, see this as a natural progression. They're taking out physical rewards from tiers so they can finalize numbers. It also does push people to upgrade who otherwise were holding off - but this is the same as Kickstarter vs Founder vs Benefactor. It's all timeline and you get there earliest, you get more digital baubles. I think they're acting as if they want to launch in 3-5 months... and rather than surprise people that pledges are done and over - I think this is a ramping down of rewards and phasing out pledges altogether. Considering Kickstarter backers would expect the game to be out by now - I don't think the clear progression is compromised. They had a year to upgrade to discounted pledge tiers, and another year still to keep progressing if they wished. As a 300$ backer the vast majority of the rewards are still available to you. Hope I caught everything. I see things in a positive slant, it's true, but I'm a skeptical person and can see where my path and yours have diverged. I have my own hates too - like towns are a morass of housing that I get lost in. And POT's I love what can be done with them - I hate that people can be booted on a whim however. I won't be settling in a POT unless I owned it (I don't own one).
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Post by FYI on Jul 29, 2015 15:20:48 GMT
As a guest I can't edit but above ^^ the first place I ran was Solania, not Owlshead, for the City Lot. Likewise, there was a town lot in Solania, not Soltown 4 hours in.
People start in Solania and that gets claimed more quickly.
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