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Post by kb on May 9, 2015 22:08:05 GMT
Not very fucking open, if some of SotA's hoity toity backers are hosting one of their "cool kids ONLY" events in said zone.... www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/i-got-multiplayer-banned-becuase-i-pvped-in-a-pvp-zone-brave-coast.25863/^FL strikes again... Banning somebody for PvPing in an Open PvP zone!? Even if he was griefing an event, wtf is FL doing banning somebody from multiplayer for going into a zone and playing the game AS ITS FUCKING DESIGNED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ? HOLY SHIT! ^So, will FL now ban Weins201 from the forums for "harassment" for the "don't let the door hit you on the ass" acronym? How about banning NET and Arianna for liking that shit too, while you're at it, oh-so fair and just Community Manager...? How is an acronym like that virtuous, FL? How is that bullshit not harassment of the OP if my "Animal Farm" pictures somehow warrant a "temporary" forum ban that's fast approaching a month in duration??? Fucking double standard on display for all to see here: The Trammel carebears who dump money into Port's coffers and kiss dev ass at every turn get treated as golden children and get "problem" players banned for pvping in a motherfucking open pvp zone! I can't even make this up it's so absurd! Most. Unprofessional. Bullshit. Ever. +1 to that, Mr. Swampthing. You make my heart sing. You make everything, sliiiiimey. SWAMP THING! ^Never fear, Corporal C-nt (Koldar) is here! Thread promptly locked, pending ham-fisted "review"deletion by the Unjust, Unseemly Lady FireSnatch.
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Post by kb on May 9, 2015 22:29:16 GMT
It appears the thread was already deleted. Damn that was quick. It was up for maybe 20-30 minutes. Good to know Port can be halfway efficient at SOMETHING (too bad it's for bullshit moderation of their forum and not actually making a fun game!)... Anyway, lol @port and FL...... you guys are fucking legendary fools at this point. GG. Maybe instead of banning somebody for pvp'ing in a fucking OPEN PvP zone, you could try to grow a fucking pair and start to put yourself in the shoes of ALL of your users instead of coddling the carebears like NET who go to an open PvP zone and expect that his event magically changes the ruleset for that entire zone!!!!
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Post by ChodeKillers on May 9, 2015 23:23:48 GMT
That is some serious pussy ass shit. Seems to me that war was declared on 4B when Net decided to be a little flower. This is simply embarrassing. Fuck FireLotus and the other Port faggots involved in this.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 10, 2015 3:13:22 GMT
Fawk I missed all this.
Let me get this straight though. 1 Some fuckers held a pvp event in an open pvp zone 2 A user wanted to take part in the event 3 Some bigger fucker said the user could not participate, in the event, in the open pvp zone 4 The user, in an open pvp zone, started to cause some disruptions 5 The user got banned
That is it?
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Post by kb on May 10, 2015 4:59:07 GMT
Fawk I missed all this. Let me get this straight though. 1 Some fuckers held a pvp event in an open pvp zone 2 A user wanted to take part in the event 3 Some bigger fucker said the user could not participate, in the event, in the open pvp zone 4 The user, in an open pvp zone, started to cause some disruptions 5 The user got banned That is it? Yeah, I really suck at explaining things and being concise, but you've got the gist. Only thing I'd add is that the user's ban was from "multiplayer", so fwiw he still has access to SP (and presumably the forums, if they only "temp" banned him... like a real temp ban, unlike mine). TBH, it's hard to say what history this player has had with Net (and FL/mods) before this happened, but at first blush, it appears they banned him from multiplayer for "disrupting" a pvp event in an open PvP zone. It really is "disgusting" that a particular group of players can dictate the behavior of people in an OPEN PvP zone (and not only feel justified in doing so, but have the implicit and explicit approval of the devs as well). The OP was correct when he pointed out that if Net and his crew wanted to enjoy their little circlejerk without disruption, nothing prevented them from going to a non-PvP zone and just using flags and duels to facilitate the fights required for their "PvP" event (which apparently couldn't handle one person attacking them in the Open PvP zone). I wouldn't normally post so much here (about this and other topics), because my wordiness of tendency to be all over the place hurts the point I'm trying to make, but I'm glad I managed to get some screenshots and that it allows a few of you to see what happened. While silenced on the official forums, at least the player who got the shaft has a voice here now and curious people can see a screenshot of his complaint. Anyway, it was removed so quickly on the forum that it was easy to miss. I bet there are things posted there all hours of the day, seven days a week, that are scrubbed away just as quickly as that OP's ragepost was.... Interestingly enough, I've noticed whenever I post a new thread here, there is normally an immediate uptick in "guests" (perhaps its SotA mods with their RSS feeds alerting them to any "troll" activity that is linking back to the official forums???). It was also pretty convenient how Chris made his post about upvoting/downvoting/leaderboards/visual filters for lawn decorations mere minutes after Grimgryphon posted about that topic. I also noticed that when Teterios' post was scrubbed, right after, Starr was viewing the forum via tapatalk. Must be great fun for him, Chris, and the mods to spend their Saturday silencing a valid complaint and babysitting their forums 24/7. So, maybe gratz are in order to Port for possibly setting up things to monitor linkbacks from here to their forums, and for getting their mods to pay close attention to what's most important to the forum's healthy discourse: Scrubbing away the complaints of angry pvp'ers who have the audacity to bitch about being banned from multiplayer for *GASP* PvPing in an OPEN PvP zone....
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 10, 2015 5:11:20 GMT
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Post by Sicherdraht on May 10, 2015 7:49:09 GMT
This is a extension of the shortcomings that exist in the forum. Tabula Rasa repeated all over again. After six months nobody plays, memory leaks, all trade marks for failure. These guys are pro's alright, top notch, Failure by Repeat, and smug like OSI, Go team Go. This game is failing so hard, you could fuck a rhinoceros with it. This is only pre-fucking Alpha. That guy is never coming back. They seriously want this game to fail and are making sure of it. Nobody does it better than they do. The dog, pony and FireLotus show in a live game. Spear me in the heart, Hay Dick! your Mom is calling, you left her in low earth orbit. FireLotus needs to get the fuck out of that game. Grab her bird it's innocence, bet she beats it with a spoon. VIEW TO A GAME KILL
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Post by An Insane Witch on May 17, 2015 19:52:40 GMT
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Post by An Insane Witch on May 17, 2015 19:55:28 GMT
I suspect this will get locked and deleted before long. Is interesting to follow. You know you are doing your job right as a PK, when you can cause such contention between community members that are usually in the corner hugging it out.
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Post by kb on May 17, 2015 20:18:42 GMT
I still can't wrap my head around holding an event in an OPEN pvp zone, and then throwing a tantrum and getting devs to ban somebody who shows up and starts to attack people in the OPEN pvp zone. It mindfucks me every time I think about it! Why even flag it as an "open" pvp zone if they're going to expect some higher code to prevail when they throw their precious little events??? They should just call the zone what it really is: Open Carebear Zone (only butthurt lil bitches allowed!)
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Post by kb on May 17, 2015 21:19:20 GMT
@envy -- Based on the things you've said in the thread that Insane Witch linked (and other threads about similar topics).... I actually really do <3 you. Thank you for saying all the things I've been yelling at my screen but am unable to post because of my forum ban... and thank god not all the reasonable voices (on this issue) have been silenced You're still totally wrong about almost everything else, and you have absolutely no appreciation for a good semi-random YT video (or the true effort it takes to write an incomprehensible wall of text for people to scroll past), but you are right about this open PvP stuff.
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Post by An Insane Witch on May 17, 2015 21:34:54 GMT
For being a voice that people liked, I have a feeling not many are going to be appreciating Amber Raine much after her views on this. Majoria and her are finally opening their eyes?
I can only imagine that this was not the direction that Myrcello was aiming for when the topic was brought up. Envy won more useless points in this thread also!
I think the winner here, is Jacob. If I were a PK, I would be glowing in the light of causing this much of a shit storm. Well played Jacob!
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Post by kb on May 17, 2015 22:32:09 GMT
For being a voice that people liked, I have a feeling not many are going to be appreciating Amber Raine much after her views on this. Majoria and her are finally opening their eyes? She's actually seemed pretty reasonable to me, which is why that you're probably right about the "community" not approving. She admits there was more going on than these PK's pvping in an open pvp zone (i.e., insults and threats), but she actually sees where the "offenders" were coming from and kinda just takes it as part of the "danger" and chaos of going to a zone like that. To me, that is where there is and always will be a culture clash between these two camps (the "griefers" and the "carebears"): some players appreciate the dynamic unpredictability that other people bring to the gaming experience. They crave encountering weird, twisted souls like Envy (camping noobs trying to do the tour quest) because it is different, a unique challenge, and totally unplanned. Other people want their game to be a very themepark "on-the-rails" kind of experience. They want familiar and happy happy (with people who don't challenge them or make their time spent gaming difficult). I don't know if Disneyland still has the motor cars that run on guided tracks, but a lot of the "softer" crowd aren't looking for unpredictable or jarring, they want go karts on guided track (i.e., safe and easy)... They want their game to be relaxing... to anesthetize their minds, or stimulate their minds in a different way (honestly, really deep and profound RP can go interesting places, and random PvP/PKs could really screw that flow up... but this was not an event like that AT ALL!)... The "hardcore pvp" crowd enjoy playing a very different game indeed, and they generally understand that there is but one code you adhere to when you play that game: survival of the fittest. Actually, I think Myrcello probably raised this point to get the non-PKs to consider the awesome opportunities for fun and side entertainment that having PKs and dangerous places in the game offers. It's no mistake this was posted in light of recent events (and his earlier post about lot restrictions). Also, it's no mistake that he linked to Raph Koster's slides from one of his presentations on "A Theory of Fun". Raph is on the record many times (and there are many presentations he's given) where he explains that hardcore pvp games are great for developers because it takes a lot of the need to create content off of the game creator (with the player vs. player drama forming the foundations of a deeper meta-game that is far richer than anything devs could ever hope to create). Just look at some of the crazy drama associated with EvE Online over the years (e.g., spies infiltrating enemy guilds, ponzi schemes/ppl raiding banks for shit tons of ISK <-- the equivalent of thousands of RL $'s). Those despicable players aren't banned from the game for doing that. In fact, that game is marketed based on that kind of stuff... and it is lauded for the intense effort and coordination that players manage to realize in their pursuit of heady goals, sweeping battles/wars, and Machiavellian plots. Where some people like Net and Weins201 see a "murderer" and want consequences and bans handed out until the bad people play nice, others see an opportunity for fun. I tend to think of PK's (especially like Envy and his buddy killing the tour guide questers) like elite world bosses. If you are unlucky enough to find them camping a certain zone that you need to get into, it's best to log in at a different time, or show up with the people and means to beat those bosses. "Invariably, Mr. Rainsford, invariably they chose the hunt!" Yeah, if he's just a troll or some nasty person starting shit, he sure was fed well in all of this. I'm more inclined to think there was some falling out between him (and his pals) and some of the people in Net's group. Then, more shit talk was exchanged, Jacob and his crew showed up and started some shit, and the people who ACTIVELY chose to enter an open pvp zone shit their britches when somebody actually attacked them and were dicks to them (as is often to happen when you go to the "bad part of town" where people are known for shit talking and fighting everybody). The thing I don't understand (since I don't bother to play this game anymore) is what is wrong with these people's "ignore" feature? Aren't they able to block the people like Jacob (so they don't have to hear his insults), and if he's attacking them in an open PvP zone, well... then either MTFU and kill your griefers or GTFO of the OPEN pvp zone you dumb twats.
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 18, 2015 3:49:19 GMT
This is exactly why I wouldn't mind putting together an event crash & gank squad now and maybe even consider awards to people who find and successfully disrupt player events in Open PvP zones. KB used the proper term: Mindfuck.
Seriously. What is it suppose to be like?
Priest: Do you Carebear McTwat take Fangirl Hugglesworth to be your lawfully wedded wife?
McTwat: I do.
Priest Do you Fangirl Huggleswor-
PK: Uhm excuse me, may I humbly interject please? I would like to declare my lawful intent to carry out my desired play-style in this open PvP zone, that is if you don't mind? I would like to gently find a way to ease your passing, we can walk over there to that patch of nice soft grass? Anything else I can do for you guys while I'm at it?
FFS.
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Post by Sicherdraht on May 18, 2015 5:31:54 GMT
Kuno, pointed out well to Starr Long, in quantitative and bad game mojo, in many posts. Port has decided long ago they can't have people like this around. They will take this fact to the bank and find out it will not cash. Blaming it on the Community, this IS called out now, from the rafters.
Making a Game? or collecting coin at the rate of a second rate used car lot?
FAIL.
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Post by Net on May 18, 2015 10:58:51 GMT
Fawk I missed all this. Let me get this straight though. 1 Some fuckers held a pvp event in an open pvp zone 2 A user wanted to take part in the event 3 Some bigger fucker said the user could not participate, in the event, in the open pvp zone 4 The user, in an open pvp zone, started to cause some disruptions 5 The user got banned That is it? 1) I very much doubt that Teterios (Jacob Canaan) was banned for PvPing in PvP area. Only FireLotus knows why he was banned though, but he did way more than just PvPing. 2) A user who cheated in our previous event, was warned no to and cheated again. 3) Of course, the event was not about killing others but gusting them of arena. Anyway I do not like cheaters in my events. And I am not allowing them to enter just because the threaten me and insult me. 4) Well, if only it was the first or last thing he did:) 5) This seem true, but again, the reason for the ban can be quite different as Jacob does way more than "just" PvPing. He exploits broken game mechanics, whispers some nasty stuff to people, even outside of the game...
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Post by Mordecai on May 18, 2015 11:49:35 GMT
Props to Net for posting. About time we heard a different perspective on this story.
1) I was under the impression that Teterios made this whole thing public. If that is the case, I can only assume that he gave a reason for his ban. If not, then we may never know, but since Port stopped giving reasons for their bans anyway, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. (For example: "DEAR SOTAGUY, YOU WERE BANNED FOR [BLANK]. LOL, AN ANON DEV") 2) How did the user cheat, just in the context of the event, or genuine hax? Did he find/create cheats, exploit bugs, or merely not play by the player-created rules of the event?
The only things that would justify a ban, in my opinion, are actual cheats and of course, meen woods. If all Teterios did was PvP in a small region of a PvP zone where players wanted to stop him for their own reasons (IE to hold a non-combat event), and he was "cheating" only by playing in accordance with the rules of the zone, well... then, I could definitely see him getting banned, but that doesn't make it right.
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Post by Net on May 18, 2015 12:23:15 GMT
1) Well, my event was on 19th, in the message he posted is stated the weekend 25th. I know he was killing flagged players just before Amber's sermon that day even though people tried to talk him down, also spammed few insults in local and who knows what he said in whispers. I had him blocked again so I missed most of what he said anyway. He also caused some havoc on Wednesday after PaxLair working hours and before that on my event, but those events are not mentioned, I think that people just had enough of him and started to fill reports on 25th. 2) Well, he exploited a bug that allows you to jump on wardrobe even though it should not be possible. I made whole thing public, it may be the best if you watch the recording of the event for yourself (alas the whispers are not captured if you wonder why Themo attacked him for apparently no reason). www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/r16-obstacle-tournament-1v1-double-elimination.23979/#post-352153-Net
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Post by An Insane Witch on May 18, 2015 14:49:12 GMT
1) Well, my event was on 19th, in the message he posted is stated the weekend 25th. I know he was killing flagged players just before Amber's sermon that day even though people tried to talk him down, also spammed few insults in local and who knows what he said in whispers. I had him blocked again so I missed most of what he said anyway. He also caused some havoc on Wednesday after PaxLair working hours and before that on my event, but those events are not mentioned, I think that people just had enough of him and started to fill reports on 25th. 2) Well, he exploited a bug that allows you to jump on wardrobe even though it should not be possible. I made whole thing public, it may be the best if you watch the recording of the event for yourself (alas the whispers are not captured if you wonder why Themo attacked him for apparently no reason). www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/r16-obstacle-tournament-1v1-double-elimination.23979/#post-352153-Net 1) She appears, at least in her posts, to understand that these people were tagged PvP. He attacked them. She says it enough without wavering, so there must be some truth to it? Or she is a really good bullshitter. Knowing who and what she is. I could lean in either directions on that one. I have also over heard her saying to others, "He stopped as soon as I showed up and told him to". Not entirely sure you should be using her event as an example of his doing. After all, she seems to be agree that it was all fair game. Is this why many of the carebears seem to hate her now? Because she accepts that being flagged PvP means you will be killed? Oh Wait! Maybe she is Jacob! Or associated with him in some way. Do tell us how you are really thinking, inquiring minds want to know. Oh yes, and we should probably not forget to mention that she also had quite the temper tantrum that day and told people to kill everyone. Many joined in, lots of killing broke out. I was one who heard it and took part. Sure, I was then killed by Jacob after helping him, but dude, we heard the call. We answered. Do you really believe that if you are flagged PVP, it should matter where you are? A PK as pointed out above by I.M. , and obvious to anyone with more then just a single brain cell, a PK is not going to stop and ask to interrupt your event and then proceed to kill you. FFS. A PK is going to see "I can kill them" and do so. This is game mechanics. Still not seeing the issue here. He is not the first, I assure you, he will not be the last. If nothing, this whole mess that the lot of you made bigger then it needed to be, is creating even more clones of this behavior. Shall we give you kudos or have you reported for causing havoc as you continue to bring light to this? Hey, dude, just asking! You seem to be against those that create havoc. Your whole carebear parade is doing a really good job of it yourselves. 2) So, what you are telling us here is this. "We are in pre-alpha, Jacob found a bug and used it, which is something we are supposed to do in pre-alpha is find and use the bug so we can report it. Instead of reporting it to get it fixed, we reported him to get him removed. We do not care about the bug, or how to fix the bugs, even tho this is our job in pre-alpha. We care that he found it." Am I the only one that just read that? You are right on one thing, this shows Themo unprovoked attacking Jacob. We are to accept one persons words over another without proof? Do we look like blind sheep here? "Oh right, you said it, it must be truth, we won't even ask any other questions, just follow along" Dude, again, think not. Others may work that way, I do not, will not, thank you play again.
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Post by Mordecai on May 18, 2015 15:09:51 GMT
It's hard to measure exactly how much havoc carebears have caused themselves by blowing up a given issue, but it's certainly an interesting idea. To be fair to Themo, his position as a participant in the event, and his overall fanboyism for SotA make it unlikely that he would attack someone without being provoked. Observe the intensity with which he defends himself (and SotA) on the forum, and it seems reasonable to expect that he would go as far as to attack a player for shittalking. To add to that, we know that Jacob was working entirely for the lel, so it seems unlikely that he was attacked unprovoked.
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Post by Net on May 18, 2015 15:58:32 GMT
@an Insane Witch
I just tried to add my point of view to the events and explain it from my perspective.
1) I do not wish to discuss Amber here, I was just saying that Jacob was likely banned for what has happened before her sermon on 25th, because that was the date mentioned by FireLotus. It is unlikely it has anything to do with mine event.
2) No no, I just banned him from my upcming event, I have not reported him for it, I reported the bug. And we do not have to use bugs in player run events if we discover them to our advantage, we have to report them. If you wish players to exploit the game during your events, it is fine by me, however I tend to do things differently.
Please do not mix me "banning" Jacob from my event for being dick and FireLotus banning him from multiplayer.
- Net
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 20, 2015 5:40:08 GMT
1) Well, my event was on 19th, in the message he posted is stated the weekend 25th. I know he was killing flagged players just before Amber's sermon that day even though people tried to talk him down, also spammed few insults in local and who knows what he said in whispers. I had him blocked again so I missed most of what he said anyway. He also caused some havoc on Wednesday after PaxLair working hours and before that on my event, but those events are not mentioned, I think that people just had enough of him and started to fill reports on 25th. 2) Well, he exploited a bug that allows you to jump on wardrobe even though it should not be possible. I made whole thing public, it may be the best if you watch the recording of the event for yourself (alas the whispers are not captured if you wonder why Themo attacked him for apparently no reason). www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/r16-obstacle-tournament-1v1-double-elimination.23979/#post-352153-Net Lulz, it is quite funny to think about that one fact alone. People flagged for PvP, and others watching, were trying to talk a PvPer down from PvPing openly flagged players. An obvious PvP flag is an obvious one. Also very funny to think about Portalarium banning someone for exporting the game repeatedly. Violation?...Violation?......Violation?
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Post by Envy Gaming on May 20, 2015 9:08:56 GMT
I can't believe the bullshit that is happening in the game lately. I don't play or fight to set rules, my view in PvP is that anything goes.If I find an exploit then I will happily use it to my advantage, as I have previously. While also reporting it, of course. That's what fucking pre-alpha is for. I will happily raid and attack players in an open PvP area as it's a fucking open PvP area. If there is an 'event', then all the better to fuck it up. It's good verses evil. That's what we did in early UO. If the care bears want to try and kill me while I'm doing it, then it's all the more fun. Those guys are complaining that they were attacked in an OPEN PVP AREA for fuck sake.
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Post by Myrcello on May 20, 2015 11:05:09 GMT
It was clear to me that this will not be Ultima Online Pre Trammel 2. I am trying as a Fan to limit the Restrictions the game is creating in regards to freedom of playstyle.
Actually even in a game this famous wording counts: If you trade Security for Freedom , you do not deserve the Freedom"
Darkstarr regarded Lot Restrictions as a necessary requirement to protect Events. I understand that. I just tried to point out the downside of it -
Many will just turn on Lot Restrictions - less freedom in game to roam around, less options to rpg, less immersion.
I just hope Lot Restrictions will be the last furher Security they ad. And some should be left to the players to resolve.
Example:
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Post by Myrcello on May 20, 2015 11:14:08 GMT
But one last thing i would like also to remark.
Alot of Freedom has been destroyed not because of PK´s who respectfully play this role, who respectfully understand the difference between a Fun Way of playing a Murderer or a Bad Person.
From the 100% of PK´s the reason so many restrictions had been implended is because 10% of them did go to far and caused for the rest of us "realistic environment" players to be in a bad position.
So if you have the luxury of playing a Game that gives you the Freedom of playing the Bad Person, respect this wonderful opportunity that a game is giving.
I am pretty sure because of DayZ Players taking it to far this game soon will see alot more restrictions. I predict the same outcome as Ultima Online Pre Trammel Time.
Thx to players being assholes and thinking it is a free behave as you want place.
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Post by Myrcello on May 20, 2015 12:04:20 GMT
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Post by Myrcello on May 20, 2015 12:07:59 GMT
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 20, 2015 12:24:16 GMT
Richard Garriott and Co accidentally created one of the best games in history with Ultima Online. They had no idea what they had until it was too late. No doubt I am sure that the story goes; omg such a great game, oh but wait a few carebears quit, shit we lost 20 bucks, we better create a carebear world!
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Post by kb on May 20, 2015 22:44:20 GMT
Me again. (I wish you could Edit older posts. I am a edit addictive) Dude, just make an account here and you can edit to your heart's content. I seriously DO NOT understand why you and Envy don't make accounts here. I guess you're scared of Port or something? Don't want to use the same email here that's associated with your SotA stuff for fear that the dastardy IM might somehow use it to log in to your stuff (or something like that)? Just www.guerrillamail.com/ , use that email to create your account, and then just make sure you use an easy password here that you're never going to forget....
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Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on May 21, 2015 0:43:53 GMT
Well they both use their sota name here anyway, unless its not really them I don't have the time to track peeps on my own forum, I mean you are here anyway, why do I need to hunt you down!
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