|
Post by fossil on Feb 9, 2016 15:15:54 GMT
On serious note is there anywhere other than the official Sota forums that have anything positive to say? Besides the Redman that doesn't even know what he's talking about. I've never seen a game get trashed so hard literally everywhere you look.
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 9, 2016 15:17:48 GMT
|
|
|
Post by fossil on Feb 9, 2016 15:19:53 GMT
I read that all I could hear was gauging... and it's not all lollipops and rainbows...
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 9, 2016 15:28:38 GMT
The Polygon site is usually pretty forgiving with SotA stuff.
|
|
|
Post by fossil on Feb 9, 2016 15:38:40 GMT
I read the comments off that link cuz the first time I read it there wasn't any. WTF dragon is somewhere in between clueless and pretending to know.
|
|
|
Post by zincturtle on Feb 9, 2016 17:19:17 GMT
From that Ultima Codex site article: Yeah, it's really not. At a detailed level, they're using the same tools that have been used for the past 15 years, in varying flavors. IDE's, API's, GUI's, CLI, Editors, "Studios", Compilers, and so on. There's no innovation here. At a larger/macro/higher-up level, as they've said themselves, they're just making it up as they go. There is no plan. If there is a design document, I can't imagine what shape it would be in, by now, with so much feature creep.
Hell, Chris and Starr came up with the entire magic system in less than 2 days, just the two of them alone. And people wonder why it's shallow and full of logical flaws, imbalance, and lacking in features?
The "whole new world" is where they told everyone they could "guide the game" and then specifically prevented contributors from affecting core systems in any way. Well guess what? If you claim transparency & collaboration, and then opacify and forbid the most important part of the product, you're incompetent at best, and most likely lying your ass off. Crowdsourcing would have been asking ONE person outside the dev team for their opinion on the magic system, prior to implementation. Or you know... dozens? Or hundreds? You know, actually gathering requirements from your customers before you design the product or solution? Wow, what a concept!? But again, that would require Humility, and that's not a virtue they practice.
It's a sad testimony to the entire genre when developer arrogance and pride is the #1 cause for bad design and bad mechanics in these games.
|
|
|
Post by fossil on Feb 9, 2016 17:51:32 GMT
It's easy to put a game together in 5 months... this is in the top 3 worst alpha/beta/w.e we wanna call it. I have ever played... they seem to think core mechanics they can just throw together with ease and no issues. In 4 months and little has changed what will everyone say?
|
|
|
Post by zincturtle on Feb 9, 2016 18:14:43 GMT
The zealots will continue to defend it, the invested whales will continue to defend the zealots, the silent majority will walk away and the vocal minority will post their negative reviews and then walk away.
|
|
|
Post by johndoe on Feb 9, 2016 19:29:31 GMT
The game is barely talked about at all, they aren't exactly adept at social media. I also see more backers openly complaining in the forums as time goes on. Its a sinking ship. Wish I could get a refund.
|
|
calico
Strong in the Force
Posts: 299
|
Post by calico on Feb 9, 2016 20:02:19 GMT
Well like it or not a few of us still have the 45 dollar bundle deal.
Anyone who questions the direction of certain things get called a negative person(at best) They litterally allow anyone who is pro them to do whatever they want on the forums. They have made their own enemmies at this point, hell it doesn't even matter the state of the game.
|
|
Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
|
Post by Caliya on Feb 9, 2016 20:38:39 GMT
It's a sad testimony to the entire genre when developer arrogance and pride is the #1 cause for bad design and bad mechanics in these games. By 1990s standards, they're doing a bang-up job. I figure, this is why they have such avid supporters. I mean, look who they are. People who are mostly >35 years old, and many (like Winfield) probably in their 50s and 60s. This stuff probably looks like rocket science to them. If people remain stuck in the past, they will never know how terrible SotA is designed (not from an artwork standpoint but from a mechanical one). Everything they are doing has been done 100 times. For Starr to say they're winging it is ludicrous at best. I'd say that it's more about how the project is managed by unprofessional and inexperienced employees. And if the CEO doesn't know the difference, lord help them. That's where we're at. People think we're purposefully trying to bash the game because we didn't get our way. But in reality, those of us who know the industry, at least somewhat, know it's the crap behind the scenes, that isn't transparent, that's the problem. Then you get a bunch of idiot cheerleaders and they think they're doing great, while the rest of us laugh at them.
|
|
|
Post by warderdragon on Feb 9, 2016 22:35:10 GMT
People think we're purposefully trying to bash the game because we didn't get our way. But in reality, those of us who know the industry, at least somewhat, know it's the crap behind the scenes, that isn't transparent, that's the problem. I think that's right on the money. The project management of SotA is quite Molyneuxesque in how it's been handled - the feature bloat could've sunk the game by itself, and that's not going into the other slew of bad decisions made along the way. Of course, it doesn't help that the community is filled with people who genuinely believe that not expressing criticism during pre-alpha somehow helps the development team!
|
|
|
Post by fossil on Feb 9, 2016 23:12:48 GMT
pot's and the card combat fiasco took what almost 2 years combined?
|
|
|
Post by zincturtle on Feb 9, 2016 23:34:42 GMT
|
|
Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
|
Post by Caliya on Feb 9, 2016 23:49:33 GMT
pot's and the card combat fiasco took what almost 2 years combined? In the latest newsletter from last Saturday, they've still added another POT design! They aren't done yet, not by a long shot. That dev time is going into that way too much. That's more than feature creep, eh?
|
|
Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
|
Post by Caliya on Feb 9, 2016 23:53:27 GMT
I scanned the first 7 pages, and what's astonishing also, is how many people that used to post that have long ago left. Or got banned. Sad.
|
|
|
Post by zincturtle on Feb 10, 2016 0:08:12 GMT
I scanned the first 7 pages, and what's astonishing also, is how many people that used to post that have long ago left. Or got banned. Sad. Yep, it's very much a "naive original pledger" versus "new bandwagon zealot" type of community, now. All the old guard saw the light and left, long ago. Once the new zealots find that one mechanic (like skill decay, semi-random semi-distracting combat UI, consensual pvp, no full loot, loading screens, mixed online economies) that they don't like, they're out. When you have your game on steam, and potential customers compare it side by side with over sevent thousand other steam titles, it's very challenging to grab a large demographic with so many punitive or negative mechanics in play. As such, it's clear they're not out to gather the largest potential demographic. Unfortunately, it's not clear to me who their target demographic is, with the current list of features, beyond the ocean of whales.
|
|
calico
Strong in the Force
Posts: 299
|
Post by calico on Feb 10, 2016 0:29:46 GMT
I scanned the first 7 pages, and what's astonishing also, is how many people that used to post that have long ago left. Or got banned. Sad. Yep, it's very much a "naive original pledger" versus "new bandwagon zealot" type of community, now. All the old guard saw the light and left, long ago. Once the new zealots find that one mechanic (like skill decay, semi-random semi-distracting combat UI, consensual pvp, no full loot, loading screens, mixed online economies) that they don't like, they're out. When you have your game on steam, and potential customers compare it side by side with over sevent thousand other steam titles, it's very challenging to grab a large demographic with so many punitive or negative mechanics in play. As such, it's clear they're not out to gather the largest potential demographic. Unfortunately, it's not clear to me who their target demographic is, with the current list of features, beyond the ocean of whales. Some of us are still around from back then...not as effective mind you, but still around. I know I posted in that thread.
|
|
dodgy
Strong in the Force
Posts: 1,171
|
Post by dodgy on Feb 10, 2016 0:41:57 GMT
The card combat had a lot of potential it just needed something else to support it.
Ie mount and blade melee and the cards come up to signify combos or openings in the opponent.
It could of really been an amazing system. Anyone who has done any fight sport would understand what they were trying to do. The implementation sucked
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 1:08:20 GMT
Hell, Chris and Starr came up with the entire magic system in less than 2 days, just the two of them alone. And people wonder why it's shallow and full of logical flaws, imbalance, and lacking in features? You can cite Violation for some of this as well, especially the order in which they now appear in the Tree itself. Ask dodgy, he will tell you all about it
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 1:11:44 GMT
Then you get a bunch of idiot cheerleaders and they think they're doing great, while the rest of us laugh at them.
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 1:13:41 GMT
pot's and the card combat fiasco took what almost 2 years combined? In the latest newsletter from last Saturday, they've still added another POT design! They aren't done yet, not by a long shot. That dev time is going into that way too much. That's more than feature creep, eh? Is there an official project management term for when scope creep totally destroys a project?
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 1:16:23 GMT
I scanned the first 7 pages, and what's astonishing also, is how many people that used to post that have long ago left. Or got banned. Sad. Yep, it's very much a "naive original pledger" versus "new bandwagon zealot" type of community, now. All the old guard saw the light and left, long ago. Once the new zealots find that one mechanic (like skill decay, semi-random semi-distracting combat UI, consensual pvp, no full loot, loading screens, mixed online economies) that they don't like, they're out. When you have your game on steam, and potential customers compare it side by side with over sevent thousand other steam titles, it's very challenging to grab a large demographic with so many punitive or negative mechanics in play. As such, it's clear they're not out to gather the largest potential demographic. Unfortunately, it's not clear to me who their target demographic is, with the current list of features, beyond the ocean of whales. Yeah, look at this dickwad: "It kind of terrifies me that the majority of these posts are pushing for multiplayer stuff. " Rune - March 18th 2013
|
|
calico
Strong in the Force
Posts: 299
|
Post by calico on Feb 10, 2016 1:48:56 GMT
|
|
calico
Strong in the Force
Posts: 299
|
Post by calico on Feb 10, 2016 1:49:12 GMT
Yep, it's very much a "naive original pledger" versus "new bandwagon zealot" type of community, now. All the old guard saw the light and left, long ago. Once the new zealots find that one mechanic (like skill decay, semi-random semi-distracting combat UI, consensual pvp, no full loot, loading screens, mixed online economies) that they don't like, they're out. When you have your game on steam, and potential customers compare it side by side with over sevent thousand other steam titles, it's very challenging to grab a large demographic with so many punitive or negative mechanics in play. As such, it's clear they're not out to gather the largest potential demographic. Unfortunately, it's not clear to me who their target demographic is, with the current list of features, beyond the ocean of whales. Yeah, look at this dickwad: "It kind of terrifies me that the majority of these posts are pushing for multiplayer stuff. " Rune - March 18th 2013 That guy was deluded.
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 1:54:03 GMT
Yes, that is exactly why it is there. There is clearly a directed effort by some to pat themselves on the backs there. They should be doing it outside their own circle jerk forum though, but then, mommy can't protect them from all us evil trolls eh.
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 4:49:47 GMT
|
|
calico
Strong in the Force
Posts: 299
|
Post by calico on Feb 10, 2016 5:08:41 GMT
In his original post he gave no ideas though.
|
|
|
Post by Membrane_on_Vacation on Feb 10, 2016 5:32:03 GMT
Yeah I'm guessing that is why they said that. That is about the depth of the I <3 SotA thoughts.
|
|
Caliya
Strong in the Force
People fight to gain things they can't take with them in the end
Posts: 2,121
|
Post by Caliya on Feb 10, 2016 8:40:35 GMT
Is there an official project management term for when scope creep totally destroys a project? Fucked up?
|
|